23 Replies Latest reply: May 4, 2015 1:58 PM by Mohmed Darsot RSS

    HP Gen9 Server

    emre cabuk

      Dear All,

       

      Do you have any chance to test or run QlikView on HP gen9 server? We have been prefering HP gen 8 servers. But now I wonder Gen9 performans and compliance with QlikView. I think using gen9  will not have critical issue, but I want to be sure if you have any surprising issue on Gen 9.

       

      The only inportant specification on Gen 9, I think it is supported intel e5 v3 cpu family.

       

      Any comment will be great?

       

      HP ProLiant DL380 Gen9 Server

       

      Thnks

       

      Emre

        • Re: HP Gen9 Server
          Miguel Angel Baeyens de Arce

          Hi Emre,

          The Gen9 of HP 380 will perform very well since they upgraded the hardware to accommodate v3 of Intel Xeon E5 processors. Most of 26XX that were supported in v1 are also supported in v2 and v3, like the 2690, 2660, 2667 and 2670.

          The features that did these CPUs work very well are there and have been improved (number of cores, clock cycles, cache and RAM, QPI) so I would only expect G9/v3 to perform even bette, since the basics that made them fit for QlikView (like SUMA, bridges, QPI and so) are still in place or also enhanced.

          Miguel

            • Re: HP Gen9 Server
              emre cabuk

              Hi Miguel,

               

              I think the cpus below are the best fit for Gen9 and QlikView considering both clock speed and # of cores.

               

              Intel® Xeon® Processor E5-2667 v3 (20M Cache, 3.20 GHz) (8 cores)

              Intel® Xeon® Processor E5-2687W v3 (25M Cache, 3.10 GHz) (10 cores)

               

              Thank you for prompt answer.

                • Re: HP Gen9 Server
                  Miguel Angel Baeyens de Arce

                  Hi Emre,

                  I would go for the E5-2667 v3 since it is the more frequency optimized of both. It has less cores, but that means that it can take better advantage of the 9.6 GT/s QPI, that has only one ring for all the cores. The 2687W has more power consumption because of more cores, but a slower QPI ring with 8 GT/s.

                  If you want to use NUMA for whatever reason (QlikView is not one of them, but anyway), then go for the 2687W.

                  Along with some nice DDR4 2133 MHz RAM, that could be just great!

                  Miguel

                    • Re: HP Gen9 Server
                      emre cabuk

                      Hi Miguel,

                       

                       

                      Considering your choice, 6 cores Intel® Xeon® Processor E5-2643 v3 (20M Cache, 3.40 GHz) will be greater than E5-2667 v3?:)

                        • Re: HP Gen9 Server
                          Miguel Angel Baeyens de Arce

                          Emre,

                          I'd rather stick to the 8 cores E5-2667 v3. The QPI ring is good enough to keep all cores running and handling well.

                          Miguel

                            • Re: HP Gen9 Server
                              Boris Tyukin

                              this is what we ended up getting and I am really happy with it. We also tried 4P DL580 beast and QV could not use all the power of it and it was 4 times slower than our Gen7 E5-2667.

                                • Re: HP Gen9 Server
                                  Miguel Angel Baeyens de Arce

                                  The HP DL580 is a beast, for QlikView you will only appreciate the performance with the E7-4870 (v1 and v2) and 4890 v2 (in case of G8) because they are part of the few only in the E7 family to have a mesh QPI bonding all cores in their CPUs therefore full access to memory modules.

                                    • Re: HP Gen9 Server
                                      Boris Tyukin

                                      Miguel, this is the one we got at first

                                      HP DL580 Gen8 E7-4870v2

                                       

                                      but in our case it was 4 times slower (no kidding) than our good old HP DL380 Gen 7 E5-2690 2.90GHz. Granted DL580 can handle way more users than DL380 but we needed speed not capacity.

                                       

                                      I actually hear some complaints on DL580 from our Oracle team as well - DB appears to be running slower on these boxes, but they did not do such extensive tests like i did with QlikView.

                                       

                                      In fact I ran 4 software benchmarking tools and all 4 showed very bad numbers for DL580 in memory tests comparing to our old Gen7 DL380 - you can check my post if you are curious

                                        • Re: HP Gen9 Server
                                          Miguel Angel Baeyens de Arce

                                          Thanks for the info borisman I'll be checking them indeed.

                                          If you want speed, definitely the E5 are the ones to go with, but if you need concurrency or capacity, our tests also measured the E7s and tests were fine. You will find more detailed info in the Qlik Scalability space.

                                            • Re: HP Gen9 Server
                                              Mohmed Darsot

                                              Hi Miguel

                                               

                                              For best speed & concurrent user performance what would you recommend out of below list.

                                               

                                              2 socket vs 4, what should be chosen

                                               

                                              2 socket:

                                              E5-2697 v3 (14 cores) vs E5-2667 v3 (8 cores)

                                               

                                              http://ark.intel.com/compare/83361,81059

                                               

                                               

                                               

                                              any other you will recommend beside these 2.

                                                • Re: HP Gen9 Server
                                                  Miguel Angel Baeyens de Arce

                                                  Hi Mohmed,

                                                  Between those 2, the E5-2667. The way it has the QPI ring built is more optimal for high demanding scenarios and huge memory sharing.

                                                  Apart from those, the E5-2690 is always a good choice, if not the best overall (for QlikView and Qlik Sense and in terms of performance in high resource usage environments).

                                                  Miguel

                                                    • Re: HP Gen9 Server
                                                      Mohmed Darsot

                                                      Thanks Miguel

                                                       

                                                      What do you look for in QPI configuration? what is QPI difference between E5-2667 V3 and other 2697-V3 & 2690-V3. when i compre all 3 in below link. Only difference i see is # of cores & base & turbo frequency. QPI is same for all 3.

                                                      http://ark.intel.com/compare/83361,81713,81059

                                                       

                                                      E5-2667 has only 8 cores hence you will end up with 16 total. Can 1 server handle 40 to 50 concurrent users while anchoring 20gb application. Is hyperthreding allowed.

                                                       

                                                      I don't see E5-2667 in Qlik list of approved server?

                                                        • Re: HP Gen9 Server
                                                          Miguel Angel Baeyens de Arce

                                                          Higher number of cores does not mean best performance when it comes to QlikView or more generally speaking, to any Uniform Memory Access apps (non-NUMA/Interleaved).

                                                          The E5-2667, being the smaller of those, has the most equitative QPI architecture, with a "ring" linking all 8 cores, 4 cores at each side (so to speak). However, the E5-2697 which has 14 cores that are unbalanced split in sides of 8 and 6, so one part of the bus will always be more loaded than the other.

                                                          Since the key for QlikView is allowing each processor to access as many memory as possible, and as even as possible, unbalancing this way could lead to eventual bottlenecks in some cores while others not so loaded.

                                                          Indeed, the E5-2667 is not in our whitelist, which does not mean it will not work, but that has not been tested in our labs. Same for the E5-2697.

                                                          Miguel

                                                            • Re: HP Gen9 Server
                                                              Mohmed Darsot

                                                              Thanks Miguel for great insight.

                                                               

                                                              You suggested E5-2690 in earlier post as best overall. Does it share the same QPI architecture as 2667.

                                                                • Re: HP Gen9 Server
                                                                  Miguel Angel Baeyens de Arce

                                                                  The E5-2690 has proven the most powerful CPU out there for QlikView balancing both number of CPUs, available RAM and CPU speed. It does not share the same QPI configuration than the E5-2667, though.

                                                                  Miguel

                                                                  EDIT to my previous post: the E5-2697 v3 has been tested and is whitelisted as of Feb 2015

                                                                    • Re: HP Gen9 Server
                                                                      Mohmed Darsot

                                                                      Hi Miguel

                                                                       

                                                                      E5-2690 does it have balanced QPI 6X6 as it is 12 cores? meaning faster then 2697 in terms of thruput. However would be able to handle more concurrent users as it has 4 extra cores compared to 2667.

                                                                       

                                                                      2690 also has large smart cache compare to 2667.

                                                                       

                                                                      2667 has advantage on higher base frequency. Turbo boost is about the same.

                                                                       

                                                                      we have narrowed our choice to those 2 CPU

                                                                        • Re: HP Gen9 Server
                                                                          Miguel Angel Baeyens de Arce

                                                                          Of those two, I will stick to the E5-2690. I have been using it for several years with great performance. Now in v3 it is even more powerful. It is not 6x6 but (4x4)+4 but the way its QPI buses communicate shouldn't be any problem.

                                                                          Anyway, if you have the chance, then test. Note that there are not two equal QVW apps except for yours, and not two equal scenarios: concurrency of users, click and select pattern, data model, expressions, UI... several factors to take into account.

                                                                          Still, if it was my take, I would go for the E5-2690.

                                                                          Miguel

                                                                          EDIT: the base frequency should not be a problem, either. If you disable all C-states according to vendor best practices, the CPU will be working as much as required without going idle and having to wake up again.

                                                                          If you are accustomed to Linux, it should be the most similar to a "Performance" CPU governor.

                                                                            • Re: HP Gen9 Server
                                                                              Mohmed Darsot

                                                                              Thanks Miguel

                                                                               

                                                                              So you think extra 4 cores of E5-2690 v3 & larger cache will prove more advantageous then higher base speed frequency of E6-2667 V3. They both can handle same memory size and frequency & I think price wise they are almost identical.

                                                                               

                                                                              For our envionment we want to PIN 1 large app (~20gb data model optimized) and 6 to 9 smaller apps with 40 concurrent users in 1 QVS multiply exact same load scenerio for 2 more QVS machine.

                                                                               

                                                                               

                                                                              Thanks for all the info.

                                                                  • Re: HP Gen9 Server
                                                                    Boris Tyukin

                                                                    our experience exactly, Miguel, I wish someone would tell us that we would save a lot of time and hassle

                                              • Re: HP Gen9 Server
                                                Sagar Mehta

                                                Hi Emre,

                                                 

                                                Use the below Blog to get an idea on Qlikview application server compatibility


                                                http://community.qlik.com/thread/126460